Deal, I think you think everybody else thinks like you do. They don't.

This election isn't even close, and Catholics, like other citizens, think it's about the economy, Iraq, and the gross incompetence and belligerence of a party (your Republican party) that has lost its moral and ideological compasses.

As for the so-called abuse of Faithful Citizenship document, many Catholics have been through presidential election seasons before. Abortion has usually not been so far on the fringes as it is this year. So except for the 22-and-younger set, this is not news to us. We've made conscientious decisions on election days past that have been well done or not so well done, and sometimes both groups have voted for at least three different parties in doing so.

The fact is that the bishops have lost a lot of cred over the past several years, that the interminably long election season is wearing on many people heavily, and meanwhile faithful Catholics have the same concerns they had last February or four years ago this past June: living a Christian life in the world as best they can.

This election is about Republican incompetence, corruption, immorality, and divisiveness. All the Dems had to do is show up on November 4th.

"Abortion has usually not been so far on the fringes as it is this year." Such a declaration betrays deep ignorance, deep denial, or just plain truculence. The Catholic media and blogosphere has dealth with little else these past several months.

Deal,
Just call it what it is: the Bernadine effect. Catholic liberal dissenters control the bureaucracy in the Church in America.

It's not ultimately consequential who get's elected president of the United States but who is sitting in the judgment seat when those who have voted in such a way that supports the slaughter of the innocents. That's what should be of concern. Start rehearsing your defense.

He is talking about abortion not being one of the major issues for the country this lyear like it was in earlier elections. That is true because people care more about their retirement disappearing than about abortion. Abortion is not going to be a election deciding issue in the same year that we have an economic collapse. The reason Obama is winning Catholics is the same reason he is winning everybody else. The economy. You can not blame that on the bishops.

Joe,
If the Economy is the reason why Americans, and Catholic Americans are going to vote for Obama, they are more duped than I originally imagined. The reason why an Economy could collapse as it did is because good honest people are not paying attention or are not stepping up and holding people accountable.

Obama is an Unknown.... I would never in a million years vote in an unknown.... hoping The Best or even a Better outcome will miraculously happen. It will not!

I heard it said recently that Repetition not Truth is what persuades... Therefore discernment, a process that few know how to do or are too busy or lazy to do, is what is required after Obama has repeatedly said HE WILL Bring CHANGE. He will bring change, if elected.... I am still hoping it will not be so.... it will not be a change for the better.

Todd: It's amazing how you demonize Republicans in your remarks as being "incompetent, corrupt, immoral, and divisive"--yet you do not give even ONE example of this charge.

Even more amazing is that you ignore the corruption in the Democratic party, which has brought us the problems we're having in the economy right now -- particularly the sub-prime mortgage crisis, which precipitated the bad economy. This was brought about because of Democrats -- not Republicans -- going all the way back to Jimmy Carter, then Bill Clinton and the Community Reinvestment Act. It was Democrats who insisted that everyone has a RIGHT to affordable housing, and it was the Democrats -- with the help of ACORN -- who intimidated banks and mortgage companies into providing loans to people with no income, no job, and no assets.

Even worse, ranking members of the finance committees in Congress (Rep. Barney Frank & Senator Chris Dodd, both Democrats) were receiving "kickbacks" from Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac to guarantee they would not be investigated (something John McCain introduced legislation to do on two occasions three years ago).

In addition, Fannie & Freddie contributed heavily to their political campaigns -- and guess who got almost the lion's share of these contributions? Barack Obama, who is now planning to turn America into a socialist nation. So consider well what you say about the corruption of Republicans -- that door swings both ways...

Todd, Deal is thinking like a good Catholic -- he has properly ordered the issues which this election is about (you neglect abortion in your list) and has rightly determined that it is pre-eminent among all the other, albeit very important, issues.

With all due respect, the response that the election "is about the economy," et al., is how one assuages one's conscience when not voting as guided by the Church. The Church's guidance in the matter at hand is unambiguous, and really, only those who are uncomfortable with it hinge their turning from it on that dangerously ambiguous clause in Faithful Citizenship.

Deal,
The fact is that your/the Republican strategy was to seek to disqualify Sen. Obama as an option for Catholics has obviously failed. The reason it has failed is that it goes against the teaching of the Church.

It makes sense to me that Democrats have held up the teachings of the Bishops, while Republicans have tried to alter, twist, or invent teachings of the Church. The teachings of the Bishops should have been the beginning point of the election for Catholics. Instead of accepting that and embracing the teaching of the Bishops, you and your Republican allies have simply tried to tear down Sen. Obama without even a glimpse of a positive Catholic case for Sen. McCain.

This all sounds like you have just given up on the election, moving into trying to blame the Bishops, and are beginning to lay the ground work to pressure the Bishops to change their teachings at the next meeting.

Why don't you let the teachers teach, appropriate that teaching, and not try to keep moving the Church to fit your own political agenda?

I don't know if you are responding to me or Todd on that . I am saying that the economy is going t obe the issue whether or not we like it. I am not saying it is a good thing but that it is a fact. Every poll for the last six months has shown it. We can talk about abortion all day but no one is listening.

If you go to the IBD poll, Catholics are going for McCain by about 9 points. Anyone who reads this document and decides they can vote for Obama - were going to vote for him anyway. Obama and his pro-abortion or pro-life apologists will twist anything to further their agenda.

Don't blame this document if Obama wins - it is the individual voters' responsibilty. The Bishops across the country have done a wonderful job of educating Americans about their resposibility in this election. When Catholics pray the Novena of Faithful Catholics - God is applying their prayers where they are needed - they are not invalidated because the language is not air-tight.

"Such a declaration (about abortion) betrays deep ignorance, deep denial, or just plain truculence. The Catholic media and blogosphere has dealth with little else these past several months."

Tactically, there is nothing to move on abortion from the presidential office, Senator Obama's supposed promise to sign an unpassed bill notwithstanding. Much of the Catholic media and blogosphere is on tilt with the Dem candidate and abortion.

"Todd: It's amazing how you demonize Republicans in your remarks as being 'incompetent, corrupt, immoral, and divisive'--yet you do not give even ONE example of this charge."

Asking for one or two examples of each might be a good topic for another post, but here goes:

Incompetence: Katrina, finding bin Laden, managing the "peace" in Iraq, and being asleep on pre 9/11 intelligence.

Corruption: the Justice Department.

Immoral: Republicans caught in sex acts, lots of the treatment of first wives by national leaders: Gingrich, Dole, McCain. At least Senator McCain had the guts to admit he erred.

Divisive: Karl Rove and his divide America strategies. Are they preaching for American to come together on the 5th of November no matter what and dig out of the hole that's been dug?

The Democrats have had their share, and I've rarely voted for a Democrat for president. But they haven't been in charge, really. I give Rep Pelosi and Senator Reid no credit for their sandbagging the past two years, but I recognize the strategy.

Regardless of how people or Catholics should be voting, social issues are getting outpolled twelve to one by all other issues combined, and by the economy by six to one. It's just how it is.

If the Congress were sitting at 50-50, and three or four justices were in their nineties, then abortion would be a big issue. It's just not: not in people's minds, and not tactically on the issue.

Let me say at the outset: I agree with Deal that the Bishop's failed to properly guide their people with "Faithful Citizenship." We deserve better. Thank God for those who have stood up for life.

However, If my personal experience is representative, the great majority of those Catholics planning to vote for Obama despite his abortion stance are those who do not attend our churches on anything close to regular basis ( if at all), and I suspect that, while an excuse is useful to them, their vote would be the same no matter what the Bishops say. Based on the absolutly positive reaction we receive to our pro-life homilies, I am certain that 80% - 90% of those attending our parish are pro-life. My experience is consistent with the K of C poll in that regard.

There would be no question on this matter if people read and obeyed Evangelium Vitae. The USCCB has no more real authority than a parish council, so I really don't care what their documents say. The last time I checked, the hierarchy was still Patriarch-Metropolitan-Bishop-Pastor. But to Episcopalians in Catholic Clothing, the USCCB supersedes the Pope.

Evangelium Vitae makes it very clear that abortion and contraception should be the top voting concerns of every Catholic. Mater et Magistra says that contraception is the most important social *and* economic issue, predicting our current economic crisis as the natural result of the hedonistic society that contraception would facilitate.

Evangelium Vitae says that, if you have two candidates who favor legalized abortion, but one supports outlawing *some* abortions, you vote for the one who supports outlawing *some*. Obama's supporters would have us believe he wants to limit abortions, yet Obama himself has clearly said that his top priority, the first thing he'd do as president, is overturn all current restrictiosn on abortion.

Obama's supporters would have us believe he's a pacifist, yet Obama says he wants to invade Iran. Obama's supporters would have us believe that the War in Iraq is "unjust". As a Buchananite, I lean towards that assessment myself, but the only thing I've heard from the Holy Father is that the war *is* just, when he spoke on the White House Lawn. I've read or heard no direct quotation from either Pope John Paul II or Pope Benedict saying that this war is unjust; just that war is sad and tragic.

Obama's "Catholic" supporters tell us that Obama supposedly wants to "prevent" abortions by promoting "sex education" and "prevention"--in other words, they are admitting that they support artificial contraception, which, as Catholics, they are morally obligated to vote to outlaw. Joe Biden, a "Catholic," has not only failed to try and outlaw contraception, but he has voted to spend milliosn of taxpayer dollars on it.

So, where exactly is the argument *for* Obama?

I think it's 12 points, not 22?



From Catholic news agency

Regrettably this is not true. I presented "Faithful Citizenship" at an adult education session in my parish and had someone come up to me afterward and say that, based on this document, she now felt justified in putting her concerns about immigration ahead of abortion and was changing her vote, and I strongly doubt that she is the only one to experience this questionable influence.
If you read some of the statements from the list of bishops who have individually spoken out on abortion you will find that they are radically different from the USCCB document in that they provide no oportunity for picking and choosing favorable passages.

For example, while Faithful Citizenship says: "There may be times when a Catholic who rejects a candidate's unacceptable position may decide to vote for that candidate for other morally grave reasons." the Texas bishops cut this excuse off at the knees: "there are no 'truly grave moral' or 'proportionate' reasons, singularly or combined, that could outweigh the millions of innocent human lives that are directly killed by legal abortion each year."

This is only one of the dozens of forceful statements made by individual bishops that have been neutralized by the USCCB. I agree with Deal, if Catholics go for Obama it will in large measure be the fault of the USCCB. It is hard to escape the conclusion that those who crafted this document will be well satisfied with their work.

I don't think you can blame the FC document.

If the U.S. is 25 percent Catholic, we can of course assume they come in all types, from the most observant to those who haven't been in a church since Confirmation.

Do we know what percentage of even observant Catholics even read FC?

Do we know what percentage of the massive 25% of the whole country read the document? I'm betting it's small.

If we can't answer these two questions, then we can't answer this article's question.

"However, If my personal experience is representative, the great majority of those Catholics planning to vote for Obama despite his abortion stance are those who do not attend our churches ..."

Variation on a pharisaical theme.

On one hand we have the "liberal dissenters controlling" the Church, and on the other hand, they're not coming to Mass anyway so who cares?

Sorry, my friends. You are off target, and in violation of CCC 2478 with this line of thinking. Lots of loyal, faithful, faith-filled Catholics don't think the way you do, don't vote Republican, yet are still coming to Mass, sometimes daily, and most don't think of comparing themselves to others of a different ideological bent. As the song goes, "all are welcome," eh? Galatians 3:28, people.

"Faithful Citizenship" has all the flaws of a document written by committee, and suffers from what might be called a "seamless garment" hangover that the Left has long used as cover for moral equivalence even where none is intended.

While the preferred ecclesial language has turned away from Bernardin's "seamless garment" and toward a "consistent ethic of life" in a belated attempt to prevent such misrepresentation, too many bishops still feel duty-bound to survey (and thereby flatten) a hierarchy of truths rather than explain it. Explaining is left to a few brave souls like Archbishop Charles Chaput, or Fr. John Corapi, and to lay bloggers.

As a result, few things are more depressing than counting Obama bumper stickers on the cars in a church parking lot.

I am pleased that the Bishops are planning to emphasize Bible reading because it appears from these posts that too little attention is paid to the source of Christianity and Catholicism, the teachings of Jesus Christ. These teachings cover a wide range of pro life issues without ranking which is most important which so many do here. In fact, His message is so clearly and simply stated in the Gospels that I find it difficult to believe anyone would denigrate Bernardin who certainly "got it".

Savannah

"This election is about Republican incompetence, corruption, immorality, and divisiveness."

Scooter Libby is the high water mark for liberals repeating this mantra of falsities. Mr. Libby got caught messaging an investigation that did not lead to a crime, no one was convicted of “outing an agent,” and Mr. Armitage freely admits he was the leaker, was he charged?, well then NO Crime.

Divisiveness? The vitriolic hatred expressed towards President Bush these eight years is unparalleled and beyond reason. In fact this is the real source of bias against the Republican party, tell a lie often enough and people start to believe it. If Bush was as bad a person as you say why did our Pope honor him by such a visit on his birthday?

As for your other examples, just more of the same--- Democratic Party talking points.

Katrina: Democrat Mayor and State Governor

Bin Laden: Declared War on America during the Clinton years

"peace" in Iraq: You know, there was a Gulf War in ’92, and Cinton did WHAT in eight years?

“being asleep on pre 9/11”: This horrific act was years in the planning, Bush was in office barely eight months.

I do agree in one area, incompetence, Republicans have done a very poor job of articulating a message --- much like the USCCB.

And sure Todd, everyone is welcome to Mass, but not all are in full communion.

Matthew 7:13-14 Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

I’m personally sick to my stomach thinking about either political party, I’m voting for McCain because he promises to protect life legislatively and judicially---that’s enough for me.

Abortion a fringe issue??

On the contrary, Obama is the most liberal P. candidate in favor of furthering the culture of death for some time. The Freedom of Choice Act is designed to completely wipe away any restrictions for the abortion industry; even partial birth abortion and parental notification laws for minors. Both NARAL and Planned Parenthood have Obama in their pocket.

Supreme court and appellate court positions where the judges are appointed (nominated) for life terms by the President could detrimentally affect this country for the next 2 generations. Agreement with Roe will once again be a litmus test.

Republicans are due very soon to lose enough seats in Congress, etc. that they will not be needed to pass or refuse Bills; no healthy debate allowing an extremely far-left liberal agenda.

The following reporter from Boston says Catholics are leaning toward the Republican ticket:

Washington DC, Oct 27, 2008 / 12:45 pm (CNA).- Bill Roth, president of the Catholic Democrats political action committee, recently spoke about pro-life Catholics who strongly oppose the idea that voting for Barack Obama is a viable Catholic option, describing them as followers of “pelvic theology.”

Roth made the derisive comments while speaking to Rick Maese, a journalist from the Baltimore Sun. Maese reported Roth's remarks on Saturday in the Baltimore Sun article “Democrats again face the Catholic challenge.”

Roth, who claims to promote “civility” in intra-Catholic disagreements about abortion, told Maese that the American Roman Catholic Church is split between "believers in social theology" who are most concerned about poverty, health care and war, and "those with a firm adherence to pelvic theology," who are driven to the polls by issues such as abortion and same-sex marriages.

“Emotions have grown heated, with Biden under attack from national Catholic groups for his views on abortion, and Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin energizing many socially conservative voters,” writes Maese.

Maese also recalls that “the top vote-getter in the past nine presidential elections has won a majority of the Catholic vote. If Obama and Biden - who would be the first Catholic vice president - are to win in November, many analysts say it will be because Democrats successfully wooed undecided Catholics, including those grappling with the ticket's support of abortion rights.”

“Just like the American people, Catholics are divided, but not along party lines,” Roth told the Baltimore Sun.
“The major Catholic story line in this election could be, ‘Which narrative wins?’”

“Still, despite these efforts, Catholic voters in recent weeks seem to be breaking toward the Republican ticket,” Maese continues.......... * * *

I pray so. many of the Bishops have been very vocal about the moral obligation of the Catholic vote to diminish cooperation with intrinsic evil, but dissenting Catholics don't listen to the Bishops who speak the stance of the Church...they think the teaching can be debated & contested. Or they don't care at all for the "brother's keeper" vote over the "selfish" vote; whatever that issue may be. And Jesus asks: when he returns will there be faith upon the earth?? Good question.

http://www.newswithviews.com/baldwin/baldwin465.htm

JOHN McCAIN PRO LIFE? WHAT A JOKE

By Chuck Baldwin
August 22, 2008
NewsWithViews.com

Once again, “pro-life” Christians are doing back flips to try and justify their compromise of the life issue by trying to convince everyone (including themselves) that John McCain is truly pro-life. However, these same people know in their hearts that John McCain shares no fidelity to the life issue in any significant or meaningful way. Like many in the Republican Party, McCain’s commitment to life is about as deep as a mud puddle.

Dare I remind everyone that the “pro-life” GOP controlled the entire federal government from 2000 to 2006 and nothing was done to overturn Roe v. Wade or end legal abortion-on-demand? When George W. Bush took the oath of office in January of 2001, over one million innocent unborn babies were being murdered in the wombs of their mothers every year via legal abortions in this country. And when George W. Bush leaves office in January of 2009, over one million innocent unborn babies would still be murdered in the wombs of their mothers every year via legal abortions in this country. Eight years of a “pro-life” President and six years of the “pro-life” GOP in charge of the entire federal government and not one unborn baby’s life has been saved. Roe v. Wade is still the law of the land, and abortion-on-demand is still legal in America.

Had John McCain and his fellow Republicans truly wanted to end legal abortion, they could have passed Congressman Ron Paul’s Sanctity of Life Act. Year after year, Dr. Paul introduced this bill, and year after year, it sat and collected dust in the document room on Capitol Hill.

What would Congressman Paul’s bill do? It would do two things: 1) It would define life as beginning at conception and, thus, declare the personhood of every pre-born child. 2) Under Article. III. Section. 2. of the U.S. Constitution, it would remove abortion from the jurisdiction of the Court. In practical terms, Dr. Paul’s bill would overturn Roe v. Wade and end legal abortion-on-demand. So, where was John McCain? Why did he not support Ron Paul’s bill and introduce a companion bill in the U.S. Senate?

How can John McCain, and his fellow Republicans in Washington, D.C., look pro-life Christians and conservatives in the eye in 2008 and expect that we take them seriously when they say that they are “pro-life”? If the GOP had truly wanted to overturn Roe v. Wade and end legal abortion-on-demand, they could have already done it. They controlled the White House, the U.S. Senate, and the House of Representatives for six long years, for goodness sake. The reason they did not do it is because they did not want to do it. They merely want to use “pro-life” rhetoric as a campaign tool to dupe gullible Christian voters every election year. And the disgusting thing about it is–it works.

check the link for the rest of the article…..
http://www.newswithviews.com/baldwin/baldwin465.htm

What McCain's stance on ESCR?

President Bush appointed 2 Supreme Court justices who may have input on Roe v. Wade in the future. The dems have a pro-abortion plank in their party I believe, while the republicans have a pro-life plank.

The dem candidate promised the pro-aborts he would make FOCA his 1st priority. Abortion takes the life of a totally innocent human being, and abortion is occuring on a grand scale in this country. Sarah Palin is staunchly pro-life by word and example. Even if what you say is true, I will vote the lesser of 2 evils - namely McCain-Palin.

Catholics who are using the Bishop's document to say it is acceptable to vote for Mr. Obama are badly mislead. The Bishops should stand up and say that they made a grave mistake when they issued the document. The Bishops shoul refer all Catholics to the Pastoral Letter "Living the Gospel of Life" --- Paragraph 23.

I think we need to pray for those Catholics who are think it is acceptable to vote for a pro-choice politician.

"Better that only a few Catholics should be left, staunch and sincere in their religion, than that they should, remaining many, desire as it were, to be in collusion with the Church's enemies and in conformity with the open foes of our faith." - St. Peter Canisius

"Even if Catholics faithful to Tradition are reduced to a handful, they are the ones who are the true Church of Jesus Christ." – St. Athanasius

I have many small and odd amusements. One of them is lying to pollsters. I consider it sporting by their impolite probe of the right to the secret ballot. I owe them far less than fiction or fact. Actually, they had the tripidation to call me intruding on my privacy. While I lack an American cultural taste for reality tv or soap operas this is as close as I can get to that sort of amusement. I wonder how many others out there are similar in this respect who have been polled.

You can't choose the lesser evil. Cardinal Shoenborn of Vienna, Austria (he was still then an Archbishop) mentioned sometime in the 1990s on a moral question if we can choose the lesser evil. He said: no one should make the mistake of "confusing the lesser evil with an ideal." In Catholic moral teaching, it is never permissible to choose an evil action. The "lesser evil" is still an evil, and a moral actor must choose another route.

In this election, we know both McCain and Obama are evil. Fortunately, we have other choices. I suggest you take a good look at Chuck Baldwin. He is definitely pro-life. See his website: http://baldwin08.com/

It is time that we look beyond these two parties. Both of these parties have worked only for their own interests. Both have anti-Catholic viewpoints on certain respective issues.

Republicans in general are dying a death of a thousand cuts this year. As Todd pointed out, the wounds are mostly self-inflicted.

Every election cycle voters face the difficult task of trying to do two very different things in one decision
a) Hire the most competent person for a specific job.
b) Install a leader who will do the least damage to the values of the nation.

On the second count alone, one is presented with an almost impossible calculus: how to weigh the death and demoralization of abortion against the myriad lesser issues (wars of adventure; depletion of US Treasury, leading to a possible US insolvency; manifestly unjust economic policies; reckless unilateralism; an energy policy that benefits oil companies and islamic extremists and no one else)? Now, any one of these issues vs. abortion is an easy contest. But put them all together and people begin to wonder about the long term viability of America itself.

It's a rock and a hard place: both sides show a lack of wisdom that is potentially lethal to a society and culture.

And yet, that's only part of the job of a voter: if you had a candidate who had what you felt was a good grasp of the values government should be reflecting, and if that person was utterly devoid of the skills required to be a successful president, would it be sensible to vote for them?

I'm writing in Bob Casey.

Ann;
You posed the question of what Mr McCain's stance on ESCR is.
Our priest most wisely had inserted into our bulletin a page that comes from Priests for Life, which details, side by side, the candidates responses to that question and many others. The Priests for Life website would be a good one to check out.
You can look at the online version at www.PoliticalResponsibility.com

Obama is not just “pro-choice,” meaning that he is personally opposed to abortion but believes a woman has the right to chose; he is actually pro abortion, believing that an unwanted pregnancy is a “punishment” (his word, not mine). If you are interested in reading how truly extreme Obama’s pro abortion views are, take a moment to read this excellent article:

http://tinyurl.com/4jjtew

Obama’s pro abortion extremism was fully revealed when he served in the Illinois senate where he opposed a bill which would have protected the life of a baby born alive in a botched abortion attempt. Obama’s position was that the baby should be left to die. That is fact, not something that has been made up. How anyone could justify voting for such pro abortion extremist is totally and completely beyond me. Moreover, it is completely against Catholic teaching, make no mistake about it.

The Church does acknowledge that voters may vote for a pro-abortion candidate, using what Pope Benedict XVI (writing shortly before his election to the papacy) calls “proportionate reasons.”

“A Catholic would be guilty of formal cooperation in evil, and so unworthy to present himself for Holy Communion, if he were to deliberately vote for a candidate precisely because of the candidate’s permissive stand on abortion and/or euthanasia. When a Catholic does not share a candidate’s stand in favor of abortion and/or euthanasia, but votes for that candidate for other reasons, it is considered remote material cooperation, which can be permitted in the presence of proportionate reasons.”

But these proportionate reasons are largely assumed not to exist except in a single case, and that is when both candidates in a race are pro-abortion. When, however, there is a clear choice between the candidates—as in the current presidential race—a faithful Catholic must vote for the one who opposes abortion. Barack Obama receives the National Abortion Rights Action League’s highest rating (100%) and its endorsement. John McCain received 0% from NARAL, and he has always been anti-abortion.

Now, does that mean you must vote for McCain? Absolutely not. It does mean, however, that if you are a faithful Catholic, who wishes to remain in good standing with the Catholic Church, you may NOT in good conscience vote for Obama. There are other candidates out there that you could write in that might be more palatable, such as Ron Paul.

I will pray for the souls of those who vote for Obama, falsely believing that such a vote is in accordance with the Catholic fatih. I do not judge them. God will be their judge. Let there be no mistake, however, that a vote for Obama is a vote that is NOT in accordance with sound Catholic teaching.

Rick and Deal,

I've been saying this for years. Cardinal Bernadin has given ecclesiastical top cover for the "personally opposed but..." Catholic and non-Catholic politicians and their chancery supporters to simultaneously 1) relativize or ignore abortion in the mal-formation of their political conscience and 2) absolutize Tier 2 prudential issues (war, immigration, welfare, environment, etc) to the detriment of non-negotiable Tier 1 life and morality issues. Thanks a freakin' lot, your Eminence! I hope for the sake of your eternal soul you were acting out of ignorance.

This was a letter I wrote in response to a Catholic who wrote expressing her support for Obama via her explanation of "Faithful Citizenship":

Abortion's horror
Wednesday, October 08, 2008

In response to Jody Cole's letter (Oct. 1), abortion is an intrinsic evil and the paramount issue in all elections at every level.

This country has sanctioned the murder of over 50 million American children since this wholesale slaughter became legal in 1973. That's 50 million innocents who won't grow up and get married, pay taxes, have families themselves or be there to take care of the elderly parents that aborted them.

That's 50 million little bodies that have been turned into hamburger by the abortionists' butchery. That's 50 million white, black, Asian and Hispanic babies -- killed by this ultimate form of racism. That's 50 million souls rejected by the ones who should love them most -- so rejected that they had to be exterminated before they saw the light of day.

What horror in history can compare to this? What war has equaled the death toll of the war in the womb? What disaster compares to the incredible loss of the lives of these children?

As long as legal abortion exists in America, America will suffer from it. As long as there is violence in the womb, there will be no peace. As long as people view abortion as a trite political football to be bandied about, the foundations of this country will continue to crumble. Nothing is more important.

-SC DOLLER,

Thomas, unless we become a theocracy, politics will always be a necessary evil.

And I’m not advocating such, they are two separate institutions of men, but one must be the moral anchor of the other.

It's time to put our full effort into forging a viable third party and stop with this nonsense. I'm tired of dancing with whores.

Jim says “how to weigh the death and demoralization of abortion against the myriad lesser issues (wars of adventure; depletion of US Treasury, leading to a possible US insolvency; manifestly unjust economic policies; reckless unilateralism; an energy policy that benefits oil companies and islamic extremists and no one else)?”

I want to puke every time I hear or read this faux argument cloaked behind a thinly veiled sheen of objectivity.

The insinuation that Republicans have a monopoly on these issues is beyond the pale.

Where as Democrats own policies of murdering babies. Wash your hands as often as you like---the stains remain Macbeth.

Bob Casey, Sixty-five percent -- voting with NARAL two out of three times -- does not a pro-life Democrat make.

Look like the innocent flower,
But be the serpent under it. --Lady Macbeth

All, the one thing that is clear from this blog, is that this issue is tearing into the unity of our Church. I would like to propose an alternative.

First, if you perceived that the FC document was intended by some of the Bishops to disuade Catholics from voting for a pro-abortion candidate - you are correct. If at the same time you believe that some of the Bishops intended to leave the door open - you are also correct. They are flawed human beings just like the rest of us. We will all read the document, do our research and pray before we make our decision. The rest is up to God.

The real point is, what are we personally called to do about the most important human rights issue of our time.

I contend that if you intend to vote for Senator McCain, you better be prepared to pray and work for policies and economic support that will benefit pregnant woman and poor families to assist them in making the right life decision.

If you intend to vote for Senator Obama, you better be prepared to pray and work for a legal framework and a cultural change of heart that reaffirms the value of life.

Since I do not see anyone on this sight who debates the value of life, I can only hope that regardless of how the election turns out, we will all find a way to get into or increase our participation in this fight. I believe that is what we will really be judged on.

Casting a vote or expressing our opinion on a blog is easy, but begining 5 November, I hope and pray we will all work to marshal the same emotion and enthusiasm toward finding a way to eliminate this tragedy from our society. God Bless you all.

Mark says "All, the one thing that is clear from this blog, is that this issue is tearing into the unity of our Church."

The largest denomination of Christians are fallen away/cafeteria Catholics.

No Catholic should vote for a pro-abortion candidate.

No Catholic should expect the government to do the work of the Church.

Government solutions to health care, the poor , ec are flawed- in many cases the government is hostile to the Church

elect the governemnt that governs least and let the chuch do what it can do.

Voting for liberal politicians and policies takes money and influence away from the Catholic church.

Also some war is defensible, when confronting evil, something the US ( and only the US) has done for 200 years, think of all the lives ruined by socialists and communists ( hundreds of millions) the only thing stopping them has been the United States. Just because you don;t have the stomach for it doesn;t mean it doesn;t need to be done.

Letting the government do the work of the church is not the answer.

If we reduce the entitlement progams and size of government, we can use our earned income as we see fit-such a s giving to the church to aid the less fortunate .

And nothing is more important than stopping the killing of innocent children. health care and food stamps don;t help the ones that have been murdered.

When we die and go before the Lord he will ask you why did what you did. You have no excuses, the Apostles are speaking out now as have the Popes. It is not permissible to vote for a Pro-Abortion candidate if a Pro-Life candidate is available UNLESS there is a PROPORTIONATE REASON. In this election there is no other PROPORTIONATE REASON that outweighs abortion. It's that simple. God will not allow you to be legalistic. Voting for a pro-abort due to the economy or the other hundred things you want to bring up is the same as Judas getting 30 pieces of silver. It's blood money clear and simple.

You guys who think you are so "on target" for who is corrupt and who is not in terms of parties don't have a clue as to the view from higher on up. Sure there are corrupt Republicans...and Democrats. Sure people can find a way to sooth their consciences by finding this loop hole or that and vote pro choice. Sadly...they just don't get the bigger picture.

ALL life is sacred. All are loved...even when they sin. But ALL will be held accountable for their vote by GOD who will be standing at that cyber booth with them when they vote. Don't make the same mistake that thousands before you have made and ignore God's words. Don't vote for the choice to end a life if you so choose (i.e., murder). Don't think that any new president will protect your mistakes.

The truth is that we have gone beyond the tipping point and we are now into the beginning of the end times. This will be a bellweather election...the last chance you can make a vote to turn this country around. If you do so by upholding the lives of the unborn...we may be able to push some of the oncoming chastisements a bit back into the future. If not, get ready for your newly elected President to show you just how badly he punked you as he begins to unfold his radical changes for this country.

The economic collapse is BECAUSE of the holocaust going on in the womb...not because it is a seperate issue or the thing that really matters. They are all intertwined...all of the issues. We should all be down on our knees as they were in Ninevah...but most of the depraved ones (depraved meaning having non-functioning brains) just don't get the bigger picture. We should be listening to our faithful priests and pastors...not the ones who want to be popular but the ones who know how bad things are getting and who know they are accountable to God and are called to a higher responsibility. It is because we bring the wrath down upon ourselves that things are spinning out of control. If the courts won't uphold the sanctity of life...then God knows how to do it. Just read the repeating theme in scriptures of how all nations who kill their children are nations without hope. Go to the book of wisdom (for you protestants, you will need a catholic bible to do so). This is much bigger than any of you think it is. And so it begins...and so it begins.

Randy from the Burgh

does anyone truly understand the Freedom of Choice Act?
It would make abortion legal on every level including partial birth and allowing botched abortion infants to die if born alive. It will nullify all gains made by the pro-life movement for 35 years including nullifying the Supreme Court rulings against Partial=-Birth abortion.
It will take away States rights to make their own laws prohibing abortion on any level.
EVeryone will have to pay taxes to pay for abortions whether they believe in them or not.
It will take away conscience clauses and all will be obliged to perform abortions no matter what their conscience tells them.
It will eventually force Catholic hospitals etc. to perform abortions.
This same type of bill is being introduced for vote in Australia. The bishops there state that if it passes, the Catholic Church will be forced out of health care and hospitals.
This will happen also in this country and it's the CAtholics who started health care here. It's a slippery slope and the next step is euthanasia. The Blessed Mother who is appearing at Medjugorje has said that abortion is one of the greatest sins. And Obama promises that his first act will be to sign FOCA! Yes there are many evils in society to consider but you must prioritize your evils--Abortion is at the top of the list. How do we say to God who creates life, "Sorry God, we are going to destroy your creation that you willed into existence!" Where do we get this authority. I beg you please to consider what will happen to this country morally if Obama is elected.

The contraceptive and abortive life styles have indeed wreaked havoc upon our culture and economy.

Sex becomes entertainment, human dignity is lost.

Loss of Human dignity is personified when some are valued less than human.

When the purpose of life is lost, the trappings of this world are glorified.

In the pursuit of worldly things people forget the seven deadly sins.

The acquisition of wealth becomes vogue.

The new meaning of life becomes materialistic.

Less work, more money, more toys, more leisure.

Bigger homes smaller families.

More broken families, more contraception and abortion.

The death of a nation and the loss of our souls.

Imagine this:

A leader is standing on a hill talking to his flock. He is telling everyone we need to help the poor, we need to love one another, and we need to stop violence overseas.

As he is speaking, just below in the valley, in full view of everyone, 6 year old children are being brought out and slaughtered. The cries are pitiful, and the violence is brutal.

Now imagine for a minute that this leader turns to his flock and says "that is terrible... but remember we need to help the poor, love one another and stop violence overseas." What do you think that flock would do? They would yell at the leader and ask "What about the horrible murder down there in the valley?"

But alas, the horrible murder is not in the valley... it is behind the closed doors of abortion mills all over this country. We don't see it, so it seems like just another "issue." Oh when will we wake up and see what is happening?

A quote from a statement attributed to the Father of Orthodoxy, St. Athanasius "The floor of hell is paved with the skulls of Bishops".

A statement from St. Leopold Mandic to a conferee priest in the United States in 1939 "Be careful to preserve your faith, because in the future, the Church in the U.S.A. will be separated from Rome."

When the purpose and value of life is lost, acquiring wealth of this world by any means possible is excusable; eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow we die.

"And there followed Him a great multitude of the people, and of women who bewailed and lamented Him. But Jesus turning unto them said, Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children. For behold, the days are coming, in which they shall say, Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the breasts that never gave suck. Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, Fall on us; and to the hills, Cover us. For if they do these things in the green tree, what shall be done in the dry?"

Then Jesus was put to death.

Todd's assertion that Republicans are immoral because they are "caught in sex acts" is laughable when you think of Bill Clinton. But the Democrats always get a pass.

Just like Obama is getting a free pass by a media that refuses to investigate him. Right now the LA Times is refusing to release a video of Obama when he attended a party for the terrorist-loving Rashid Khalidi and his cronies. It's easy to imagine the kind of anti-Semitic remarks that went on.

Can you imagine what the media would do if McCain had attended a meeting with terrorists? And all they do is talk about Sarah Palin's clothes.

Deal,

You are correct. I post on many sites and Catholic's are ignoring the later messages in order vote for who they want.

Even on this site one sees many people that believe the Democratic rhetoric. Such as John McCain is not against abortion. These people are not doing any research. Sadly, our country relies of 30 second adds on TV. We are slowly losing our rights to vote because people are not willing to investigate the truth. It is truly sad.

I am preparing to help with a Project Rachael post-abortion healing retreat in a couple of weeks.

For those who feel abortion is no big issue, you should be forced to sit in a room with post-abortive women and men and hear about how this "choice" ruined their lives. Thank God for the mercy we have in Jesus Christ and for the good people working in this important ministry.

I have served as a priest for Project Rachael over the past 7 years. In spite of the tremendous lack of support the ministry receives from bishops, priests, and laypeople, I thank God daily that this important ministry exists and that people who have been wounded through abortion can find their way back to the merciful arms of Jesus Christ.

Many of these posts reveal people just don't care about the whole reality of abortion and want to make-believe it is no "big" deal. I see things differently and when you mention the word abortion all I can do is have flashbacks to the countless testimonies of those who were deceived into making this choice.

Our Church is in desperate need of renewal on every level. I pray for the new Pentecost daily even as the signs point to people who are increasingly being conformed to the "thinking of this world" rather than experiencing the renewal of their mind and doing what is pleasing to God. (cf. Romans 12:2) The gift of hope does not allow me to give up the fight.

In the early church many Christians were found in the colliseum even as their own brothers and sisters were being put to death. I guess things are no different today. We need more people like Telemachus who challenged such activities and by the spilling of his own blood convicted them of their sin and compromise.

Sarah I 100% totally agree with your explanation, it could not be explained better than that. And Catholics out there, our homage is to the Holy See, the Vatican, not the US Conf of Catholic Bishops, remember that. They are a local, regional body which is under the Holy See, and the Holy See can dismantle them at any time. So please take your direction from the Vatican/Holy See. And remember that nations that kill their young will self destruct, so no matter what Catholics out there, you CANNOT vote for Obama!

Thank you so much for that link. Very straightforward and easy to understand.

Looks like McCain has the same opinion on embryonic stem cell research as Obama?

How do you all reconcile McCain's stance on ESCR?

People of good will, take heart.

Doing what is in your power to sway this election toward the angels does not require that you carry the burden of it in your emotions.

Have you not done all that is in your power? Very well, then: Go do it, cheerfully. Have you done all that is in your power? Good: Then rest in the knowledge that God is responsible for handling anything you cannot.

Folks who refuse to see the forest for the trees represent a temptation to us, not merely to the Catholic voter who doesn't know better and might be looking for an excuse for supporting "The Son Of FOCA And Lion Of NARAL."

The obstinately misguided represent a temptation to become frustrated on behalf of The Truth, as if The Truth cannot take care of Himself. And they represent a temptation for us, through frustration, lose charity with them, even though they are our brothers in Christ.

Or, at least, that is how I sometimes feel! (Don't let anyone imagine I'm preaching to anyone less than myself, here!)

The world is round, and a vote for Obama is a moral evil, to state two self-evident conclusions. But arguing with flat-earthers, literally or by analogy, ceases to be productive at exactly the moment it becomes frustrating, for at that point the bad feelings undermine whatever community-building value the conversation had.

The only other value the conversation could have had was to communicate truth in the hopes of persuading the other. But have you ever known a man who justified an adulterous relationship on the basis that "God led me to meet this person" ...or some similar sophistry? We have here the same deal. They'll produce reams of evidence to back up their view: "All lies in jest, still, a man hears what he wants to hear, and disregards the rest."

So (and again I speak to myself, here), take a deep breath. Plant seeds where you can do so graciously. Defend the truth by logic where the opportunity presents itself, but without rancor, and when the exercise becomes fruitless, move on to something more beneficial.

Like, fasting and praying.

How much time, after all, do we spend attempting to convince in a week's time someone who is not constitutionally predisposed to revise their deeply-held notions less gradually than over the course of years?

And how much of that time would be better spent pleading with One who knows the Truth already, far better than we, and who has the power to do far more about it, if we only ask?

So, with apologies to Bobby McFerrin: "Don't worry, Be productive." There might not be much to be happy about in this election, but we can still spend our time productively.

'Nuff said. I'm off to pray about it, and eat a lentil lunch. (Alton Brown's recipe, and a good way of fasting from meat, by the way.) And then I'm back to work: And let tomorrow care for itself.

(Because, having written all this, I'll feel a like total doofus if I don't also act on it.)

It's quite simple. Lifelong Democrats are trying to rationalize voting for Obama. If the Democrat Party was Pro-Life, there would be NO issue.

Prior to 1973, voting Democrat was the Catholic thing to do.

This is NOT about "Republicans" trying to manipulate Catholics into voting a certain way..... this is about Catholics acknowledging that we can not vote for a Pro-Abortion candidate.

"How do you all reconcile McCain's stance on ESCR?"
Written by Ann

Ann, are you serious? Abortion kills almost 4000 unborn human beings every day, and close to 50 million since 1973.

What are your stats. on ESCR?

Lorraine and Sarah,

That's exactly why I tend to ignore the USCCB and go right to the top: the Holy Father himself. He should disband all bishops' conferences for the useless bureaucracies that they are.

I sincerely believe that the economic crisis (caused by the Democrats) that we are in is JUST a smokescreen to get Obama elected. How anyone can vote in favor of murdering thousands a day while they are still in the womb is horrific and yet that is just what our Democratic candidate has done. There are things much more important than money and that is LIFE. God Bless!!!

Given the promise of passing the Freedom of Choice Act and the opportunity to select Supreme Court judges that would ensure the security of the Roe v. Wade decision this presidential election could be the end all be all concerning the issue of abortion.

The reason for the pivotal determination on the abortion issue stems from a proposed provisional shift of the social conscience on the matter of abortion that would result in the decline of pro-life supporters.

This decline would come as the result of natural order. For anyone who has been involved in the pro-life movement can attest to the fact that a very large base of pro-life supporters is made up of catholic senior citizens. This base would dissolve over the course of the next 4 years and further so over 8 years.

Church studies and polls have shown that less than 20% of catholics are active members (attend Mass regularly, excercise reconcilliation, attend adoration, participated in ministries, etc...) in their Church.

Quite frankly, these active members are the heart of the present day Catholic Church. They are so because they are more connected to the heart of Jesus. And, a large percentage of these members make up the base of the pro-life movement.

The problem facing the pro-life movement is that this base has not been replenished to the degree where it could withstand the impending decisions (Foca and the Judges) and present an adequite challenge to them in the future (potentially decades). This being said, if Sen. Obama is elected president then there exists the strong potential that abortion rights might never be overruled.

I, re-emphasizing I, believe that this upcoming presidential election posesses, because of the abortion issue, the fate of humanity.

I realize that most intellectuals would perceive my last statement as alarmist or emotional and in truth it is, however, it should not be dismissed.

I call heaven and earth today to witness against you: I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. Choose life, then, that you and your descendants may live, Deutoronomy 30:19

Catholics, Christians, and Americans alike are being presented with a choice that will determine the fate of many persons and potentially all persons.

Because the relationship between man and God is reciprocal in nature (as you sew so shall you reap, Abraham's willingness to sacrifice his son and God's willingness to sacrifice his Son, etc...) then, at least in theory, humanity should be prepared to reap from the decision to support abortion on demand (Foca) and potentially permanent pro-abortion legislation (Judges).

Given this supposed hypothesis then imagine the potential horror that awaits the culture that supports the mutilation and descruction of human life.

It's an understatement to suggest that it is going to be bad. And, its not as though we haven't been warned. Hundreds of visionaries, many of which who have been approved by the Church, have forseen the horror.

For those who attended Mass this past Sunday may recall the second reading, "The wraith of the Lord is coming...".

What excuse might someone present to the Lord in defense of supporting the continuation of mass murder that is provided by abortion legislation? Are we deserved of any punishment?

The greatest grievance I have with the Church is that it has enabled ignorance on the subject of abortion. It just has not done enough in presenting the truth and the Church's position regarding abortion to it's members. God Bless the many Bishops who have come forward recently and expressed courage in their efforts to teach the truth on the matter. I just hope it's not too late.

Lastly, we mustn't be afraid. Fear is the weapon of the enemy and that weapon is being weilded in the form of economic crisis. This fear can be so great that it blinds us and make us deaf to the most important issue to God, preserving the sanctity of life. The fear becomes so burdensome that we perceive the only way towards alleviating it is to vote for change. This change would lead to having all laws restricting abortions, including federal and state funding, to be abolished.

Mark,

Embryonic stem cell research is an intrinsic evil. McCain supports it. You can make a prudential decision to vote for him, but you can't deny that he supports a moral evil. Ann is right

I went to a presentation for four weeks on the USCCB document. It was a waste of my time and those who actually might have been confused about how to vote. The priest presenting it was as ambiguous as the document itself.

I am happy that many of our Bishops are now scrambling to correct the falacies found in the document. God bless them and give them strength to continue, but it really is coming a little late. Truly, why hasn't the issue of abortion been shouted from the pulpits for the past 30+ years? Maybe Todd would not be saying it isn't that big an issue compared to the economy if it had.



Ann, I don't reconcile it. I pray he changes his mind and think Sarah Palin is one to help him do so. However, I do believe the USCCB's document makes some sense in that it tells us sometimes we have to do what would result in the least evil. McCain is wrong on this, but Obama is wrong on ALL Life issues. 45,000,000+ dead babies in the US alone...there is no proportionate reason for that. Even if you add ESCR, all the dead in Iraq war, and all the dead to capital punishment together, it is not equal to the horror of unrestricted abortion on demand that Obama would support and have you and me pay for with our tax dollars especially since Obama also supports ESCR. All evidence suggests Obama is also a Marxist, another thing the Church teaches is evil. But our liberal Catholic brothers and sisters ignore that teaching as well. They want a king/government to take care of all their wants and needs so they don't have to do it themselves. Read 1 Samuel 8... And they will walk over the broken bodies of 45,000,000 dead babies to have it. God have mercy on our country.

I have included the following words from Mother Teresa, given in a speach at the national prayer breakfast;
we remember that God loves us, and that we can love others as He loves us, then America can become a sign of peace for the world. From here, a sign of care for the weakest of the weak - the unborn child - must go out to the world. If you become a burning light of justice and peace in the world, then really you will be true to what the founders of this country stood for.
If we are contemplatives in the heart of the world with all its problems, these problems can never discourage us. We must always remember what God tells us in Scripture: "Even if a mother could forget the child in her womb" - something impossible, but even if she could forget - "I will never forget you."

On the last day, Jesus will say to those on His right hand, "Come, enter the Kingdom. For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was sick and you visited me." Then Jesus will turn to those on His left hand and say, "Depart from me because I was hungry and you did not feed me, I was thirsty and you did not give me to drink, I was sick and you did not visit me." These will ask Him, "When did we see You hungry, or thirsty or sick and did not come to Your help?" And Jesus will answer them, "Whatever you neglected to do unto one of these least of these, you neglected to do unto Me!" MOTHER TERESA OF CALCUTTA

To all of you liberal bishops and lay catholics who plan to support Obama and and other liberal and/or democratic politicians who support the anti-life agenda. There is alot of blame for the condition we are in and where we are heading in America ... But the greatest amount of BLAME will be directed at you ! God has made it very clear to all of us, for so very long. If Barach Hessian Obama is elected as president, then the blame can be placed directly on liberal Catholics, who were told the truth but ignored it and You Liberal Bishops, who have not taught with faithfulness and clearity the truths of the Catholic Church! If a catholic person is in error and we do not correct them, we shall be culpable, along with them, before the Lord ... but if we have done our best, in Love, to correct those in error, and they still refuse to listen ... I don't believe the LORD will send us to HELL with the obstinant and unrepentant catholic sinners. PRAY AND HOPE!

Thanks for this quote. IMO, this reality is coming fast and could happen within my life-time (I am in my early 40's), the radical liberation theology Catholic Church of the NCR, Commomweal, Most of the Jesuit Universities in the U.S. should be true to their core ideologies (abortion, same-sex marriage, pro-homosexual agenda) and go to the Unitarians or Episcopalians and leave the rest of us Catholics loyal to Rome the "hades alone".

If Obamatopia gets elected, and pushes FOCA, this may happen next year. 50 Bishops have no publicly challenged the principles used in Faithful citizenship. Cardinal Egan linked Abortion to Nazism just today (see EWTN link). With Former St. Louis Abp Burke now the head of Canon Law for the Vatican (and soon to be Cardinal Burke), I can see this group of Bishops (50 referred to above) beginning to move to forbid Holy Communion for "so Called Catholic politicians" who based on prior history, or likely to support Obamatopia's push for FOCA and other laws like the Hyde Ammendment, with Abp Burke backing them with Canonical penalties.

Oh how this thing gets my Sicilian blood and temper boiling. Assuming Obamatopia gets elected, oh how I pray these 50 Bishops make a move to forbid "Liberal Democrats who claim to be Catholic" from Holy Communion so we can go ahead and split the Catholic Church into orthdox loyal to Rome and heterodox heretics (i.e. those who support Obama).

Pax et bonum

Faithful Citizenship is precisely written for the faithful; those who "think with the mind of the Church" and are interested in cooperating with the good. It was not written to persuade erring and dissident Catholics, but to clarify issues.

It's message is crystal clear for those who "see with eyes of faith" having have been properly catechized in the Faith and now desiring to please Jesus, but adversely it has become a hindrence & a stumbling block to those who have allowed themselves to be blinded by their sins & conformed to the present Age, the World & Satan. Then its precepts are used to procure selfish gains.

Today, many Catholics are half-heartedly following Jesus with one foot in the World and the other barely in the Kingdom. Many talkers but few walkers. It will split them in two; eventually (before death--whenever that may be) they must make a choice for the Master's Kingdom and if they don't, well, they will find that a choice has been made for them as they remain in Satan's kingdom of selfishness for eternity.

Perhaps this document's weakness stems from the fact that it was written with the assumption that Catholics still observe boundaries and that Catholics are presumed intelligent as they have been infused with the fullness of Truth.

Morality is the key. The Catholic vote is different from all other votes because it is a moral vote. What God wants; not what we think we need. If we 1st advocate God's will in the world, then God will care for our specific needs in the World. Seek 1st the Kingdom of God and all these things shall be added besides.
Simply put; Catholics must live the Scriptures. Those who are ignorant of Scripture are truly ignorant of Christ.

"In the Ways of God, he who does not progress loses ground."
--LaGrange* Daily dying to self & continuous conversion as we cling to the Vine is the narrow path...no cooperation with evil.

O marvelous Exchange; of our selfish small souls to God Who gives to us in return the totality of Himself--Perfected Love.

Our Lady is our most faithful guide!
Our Lady of Guadalupe, Patroness of the Unborn, pray for us*

Mark, I wasn't trying to be a nudge. As you can see upthread, I didn't even know the answer to the original question.

I sincerely wanted to know if it was true that McCain supported ESCR, and also, how commenters here felt about that. And yes, how a Catholic can reconcile voting for him if he does support it.

For the record, I am not voting for Obama, because I know I cannot, although I do lean Democrat on most issues other than the life issues. I hope that gives context to my question.

To Pamela, so it's a question of magnitude? Even though both support intrinsic evils, we are to choose the lesser of the two?

There are many praying and fasting prior to this election. Most of those who will be praying are pro life and hoping that the most pro abortion person ever nominated will not be elected. Our Lord and His Mother are hearing those prayers. Our Lord gave us free will and asks us also to carry the cross to help him carry out His work. So what choices do we have to help our Lord carry out his work in this election to protect life?

1. not vote. We may not like McCain or Palin and will not vote for Obama so we do not vote. We hold a position that to vote for someone that might support a war we disagree with or a position on embryonic stem cell research is also wrong or evil even though it is hard to imagine it being close to 50 million dead infants.
2. vote for a third party candidate. About the same as not voting as no third party candidate will be elected ever. It will not happen and those who think this way need to come back to reality.
3. Vote McCain / Palin as the best way to stop Obama from gaining power in America. It is not just the Supreme court, but all judges and also the power of the executive order. Obama would have unchecked power with a strong democratic majority in congress and a still liberal supreme court. We need to understand we are electing someone that might have as close to the power of a king than we could ever imagine and the strongest pro baby murder belief that we have ever seen.

So which one would help our Lord answer our prayers.

Some quick research will put this into some additional context. ESRC is becoming less of an issue than it was when McCain first ran for President in 2000 against Bush. In fact, empirical research is consistently showing that Adult stem cells have more promimse and thus will make the ESRC issue a mute point.

Since Roe V. Wade (1973), some 50 million unborn Children have been killed, hmmmm, the Nicene Creed reads "I believe in God the Father Almighty maker of heaven and earth and all things seen and unseen", yet dissident Obamatopia Catholics still say that education, social justice, government sponsored health care override abortion. NARAL, the most radical Pro-Abortion group in the country gives Obamatopia a "100% rating". McCain, on the other hand, gets a 4% rating.

Thus, McCain's Pro Life views are the anthesis of Obamatopias

How true!The responsibility, urgency for action, and power for a real change on abortion, rests primarily in the hands of our bishops! They are not meeting the challenge!

One of the most prominent pro-life leaders wrote, "the Church is not confused. Statements of the Pope, various Vatican officials, committees and officials of the USCCB, and the entire body of US bishops, all point to abortion as the fundamental human rights issue of our day."

If the Church is not confused, then why are millions of Catholics, and other interested parties, so confused, and for so long a period?

The recent heretical nonsense of Speaker Pelosi is the culmination of the USCCB's failure to communicate the specifics of this foundational issue with clarity. The Holy Spirit used Pelosi to force some of our bishops to wake up to their responsibility! It's an undeniable fact that the USCCB has been ineffective in promulgating Church Doctrine in recent decades, and they've been particularly ineffective on the foundational issue of abortion!

The USCCB holds in its hands, the most powerful potential weapon for bringing the abortion slaughter to a halt! Catholics are the swing vote that will determine the next president! At this most critical period in our history, Catholics needs prodding and specific direction, from the bishops!

The magnitude, duration, and the infamy of "Catholics" openly supporting abortion, obligates the USCCB to take action before the election or the next humiliation will be a pro-choice president elected by Catholics! Then the Roe v. Wade and Doe v. Bolton decisions will be set in concrete.

Our bishops must have the will to officially announce, clearly, forcefully, emphatically, and unambiguously that Catholics who claim to be pro-choice, and who stay unrepentant, have stepped outside the body of the Church, and should no longer call themselves Catholic!

Most Catholics don't know that they can't be pro-choice because the Bishops won't say it. In fact, dozens of high profile "Catholic" politicians have shown us how they can climb to the top of the political ladder by being pro-choice. It should be obvious that high level lies demand a high level challenges from a united Church. “Faithful Citizenship” was another missed opportunity for brevity and clarity. It was an example of what I call religious correctness, an offshoot of political correctness, the belief that language and practices which could offend religious (political) sensibilities should be eliminated.

Pope John Paul's "be not afraid" message was a direct appeal to our American Bishops to be more proactive on abortion. He was hoping that they would "act" heroically; he knew that the world would be watching the American Catholic Church, and the American media.

As far back as October 7, 1979 at the Capitol Mall in Washington, D.C., Pope John Paul II said, "If a person's right to life is violated at the moment in which he (or she) is first conceived in the mother's womb, an indirect blow is struck also at the whole of the moral order, which serves to ensure the inviolable goods of man. Among those goods, life occupies the first place."

The new "Catholic Catechism for Adults" says it clearly, Christ chose his apostles, and the apostles chose men to be bishops to succeed them, and handed on to them "what they received from Jesus' teaching and example, and what they learned from the Holy Spirit. The pope and bishops in union with him are successors of the Apostles and inherit the responsibility of authoritative teaching.

"In Luke Chapter 8, Christ said, "my mother and my brothers are those who hear my word and act on it."

Abortion is a lance in the side of Christ. It is our explicit duty to be active in the spiritual works of mercy, and the USCCB is not excluded.

Prayers for our preborn citizens,

Charles N. Marrelli
Writers for Life
182 Las Palmas
Irvine, CA 92602
949-387-7845
This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it

Many Catholics are Democrats. The last election was a fluke - Kerry was unlikeable for many reasons, so the Catholic Democrats could quietly (in their own minds while in the booth) use abortion as an excuse not to vote for him. Most Catholic Democrats are swooning over Obama as the next JFK, so they now conveniently ignore the abortion issue this time around.

I know, my mom is one of them. Even when I tell her the Church says voting for a pro-death candidate is cooperating with evil and working with Satan (which is the Church's position) she wants none of it. Even when I tell her supporting those candidates comes close to an excommunication-in-fact (having, procuring, supporting, assisting an actual abortion is an AUTOMATIC EXCOMMUNICATION from the Church - and Excommunication means unless you repent via the Confessional, you most likely are going to hell when you die, so it is very very serious stuff).

So it is just a reflection that most Dems like Obama and also most Dems are also Catholic.

Greetings,

From my position as a practicing Catholic who supports Obama (condemn me if you wish – pray for me regardless), I truly hope the American Hierarchy explores new avenues to oppose and reduce the number of abortions in this country after the upcoming election.

Many Catholic voters now assume (rightly or wrongly) that American Bishops simply prefer Republicans. We now know that every four years there will be letters waiting for us in our pews exhorting us to vote against the pro-choice candidate (usually the Democrat), and that to do otherwise is an untenable position. We know that there will be threats to refuse the Blessed Sacrament to politicians who have voted pro-choice.

But if Senator McCain is so eager to end abortion, why did he actually travel to Connecticut in 2006 to campaign for the re-election of Senator Joe Lieberman – a man whose pro-abortion position is more radical than either the democrat or the republican he faced in the election? Would Sen. Lieberman, or Mayor Giuliani for that matter, really be supporting McCain if they thought he actually intended to outlaw abortions?

It could be argued that the pro-life movement has greatly diminished Sen. McCain’s chance to win this election. Tom Ridge recently stated (and I am inclined to believe him) that if he were the Vice Presidential nominee, McCain would be winning in Pennsylvania. Why wasn’t Gov. Ridge selected? He is considered a pro-choice Catholic and therefore unacceptable. Why wasn’t Gov. Romney selected? The pro-life credentials of this devout, family oriented, accomplished leader were suspect. Mitt Romney is a cultural-conservative with the ability to win election as the governor of Massachusetts - the most liberal State in the Union, but his position on abortion was suspect. Is this is how we are going to end abortion?

Friends, if we are going to end abortion, we have got to come up with a new plan. And it cannot simply be a matter of consigning your co-religionists to hell if they vote for a pro-choice candidate. Furthermore, I suspect that this will be the last time the Republicans will nominate a resolutely pro-life candidate for some time. Above all, parties want their nominee to be elected.

In Peace,

NHCatholic

John McCain has a 100% prolife voting record. So where do you get the story that he's proabortion? On the other hand, Barack Obama has a 100% proabortion voting record. In fact, Obama went so far as to vote infanticide after a "botched" partial birth abortion. Yes, if by mistake a baby servives a partial birth abortion, according to Obama, the baby should be allowed to die. I detect much cruelty in Obama's heart. Of course Obams's action proves it.
P.S. At least Bush has helped in saving some babies in a partial birth abortion legislation, thanks to the two supreme court justices that he appointed.

"Friends, if we are going to end abortion, we have got to come up with a new plan."

More talk like that and they'll start calling you a heretic.

Abortion is an addiction for both hard-core opponents and supporters. Like an alcoholic, there's confidence from the True Believer (on either end) the problem can be controlled. Just give them more money, more orthodox candidates, better bishops, clearer teaching, more clinics, more availability of counsellors, nurses, etc.. It's crazy.

I'm sure there are some smart people in both parties who are thinking they want to surface competent candidates who can be elected. They know that Democratic apathy toward Catholics probably cost them the White House in '88, and maybe 2000. Some of these people probably roll their eyes when the abortion contingent starts talking. Pretty soon they'll just give the offenders a drink and ask them to step outside.

Are you watching the swing states? Not as many Catholics in North Dakota, Montana, Nevada, Mississippi, Missouri. The Dem candidate is polling the same margins in Virginia and Wisconsin. I'd say FC and the bishops have shown themselves irrelevant.

Time for a new plan on November 5th, hopefully one that doesn't involve consignment to Hell. Leave that one for the Lord and take a nice drink instead.

I was speaking to an old man who lived through the 130s and 1940s. He commented on the way people will follow a charismatic leader who promises them something better even if the promises are not rational. He explained that a lot of people will always look out for themselves and that this is why it is difficult to root out injustice and evil in the world. selfishness, he said was at the root of those problems in the past and he said are the main reason for the current maladies we face today.

Selfishness.

It explains why people do not care enough about the baby in the womb to vote pro-life.

And for the record McCain is pro-life. Obama is pro-abortion. This is confirmed by words, actions, voting records, and endorsements. The major right to life and anti-abortion organizations endorse McCain. Planned Parenthood, NARAL, NOW all endorse Obama.

Regarding ESCR, their records are very different and in personal conversations with McCain he has said that he sees no reason to advance ESCR because of the good work being done with adult stem cells. He understands our concerns and has stated on his web site that he will not support any research that compromises ethics and morality. Obama supports expanding ESCR research even in the face of the evidence that it will not work and does not hope any promise despite all its hype.

But I digress. The old man told me that people will believe what they want to believe and will disregard the facts if they are contrary to what they want to believe. This accounts for the Kmiec types who will disregard the hard evidence of Obama's pro-abortion ways.

Finally those of you who have counseled a woman not to have an abortion, or who have helped a woman, or have stood in utter frustration as a weeping sobbing child is forced into a clinic by her "father" know that the real enemy is the complacency that grips this society. Planned Parenthood are in business because we let them be. It is easy for Todd and others to blame Republicans so he can feel "good" if they end up voting for a pro-abortion extremist like Obama. It is the old "you forced me to do it" excuse.
People will use the fact that Deal is a partisan to dismiss his legitimate criticism about the weak handed approach of certain bishops over the years. Yet while everyone wrings their hands, the babies die.

While Catholics ignore Church teaching, babies die.

While Catholic politicians make excuses and ignore Church teachings, babies die.

And in the case of Barack Obama, his pro-abortion policies mean not only that babies die, but that black babies will die, and Latino babies will die, because he wants the government to pay for the abortions of poor women.

but then no one who is voting for Obama really cares.

And if that sounds harsh, I'm sorry - but its true.

Bush had 8 years to stop abortion and doesn't even enforce partial birth and didn't save Terry Schivo either. So I'll pray the women makes the right decision to not kill her child now instead of trying to pray to reverse Roe vs. Wade. But lets keep those wars going at 2 billion a week while we bankrupt our country, and as an Ohion in a recession for 15 years--- lets keep sending jobs to Mexico and China. Bush has us in major debt to communist China etc.... while MCain will continue these wars. Well, I'll take Bush's words sort of----fool me once shame on me..fool me twice ya can't get fooled again. I'm voting for Obama.

Peace also to you, NHCatholic!

I strongly disagree that had McCain selected Tom Ridge, he'd be doing better in the polls.

He'd be doing worse.

What you must understand is that he only got nominated by a fluke of primary math unlikely to happen more than once a hundred years. In short: He was every Republican's fifth or sixth choice, but their first and second and third and fourth choices all disagreed, so he managed to luck up on that score. That's rare. He also lucked up because, unusually, all the candidates who could plausibly (ideologically and stylistically) have taken his place as "compromise candidate" after everyone's first- and second-choices were gone, didn't have the money to stay in the race long enough for all those first and second choices to get eliminated. That's even more rare. Finally, because he'd won Mainstream Media love in the past, he had better name recognition.

But back when the primaries started, party-faithful Republicans, especially the conservative base, ranged in their feelings about McCain between grudging neutrality and bitter hatred.

I'm serious. When the primaries began, I said I would not vote for McCain, because he'd knifed the conservative base in the back far too many times. (That, after all, was what was meant by being a "maverick," and why the Mainstream Media loved him. Georgia Senator Zell Miller was to Democrats what McCain was to Republicans...but you'd never see him getting such gentle Sunday-show treatment for being a "maverick.")

Until Sarah Palin was added to the ticket, I was seriously contemplating leaving the presidential slot empty and voting party-line Republican (or a few local Libertarians; where I live, they sometimes win).

Once Palin was added, I became energized. I contributed money. Because it was the first sign McCain gave that he had any desire for a rapprochement with conservatives, whom he'd so consistently and snubbed.

The truth is that much (possibly half) of McCain's base would have stayed home without Palin. It would have been a blowout: McCain might have won five states.

By locking up his base with Palin, he gave himself the freedom to try to continue the race.

Now do you see why Ridge would have utterly failed to serve?

It's a 40% left, 40% right, 20% independent nation. You can get elected with your base, and half-plus-one of the independents. But if your base stays home, there aren't enough independents in the world to get you there.

Sure, some people don't care for Palin. But in McCain's electoral math, she loses him 5% and gives him 20%.

NHCatholic,

I will pray for you and I do not condemn you. We are all diminished if even one of us is diminished. I certainly do not know your ultimate fate, but I would encourge you to take it up with God before He initiates the conversation.

As to your point on picking a pro-abortion running mate who might better help McCain to win, with all due respect, that is exactly what the Church doctrine says we cannot do. We cannot make an accomodation with intrinsic evil in hopes that something good will come of it. This is exactly what is wrong with Professor Kmiec's entire thesis about why a Catholic can vote for Obama.

I will not go through all the arguments about why a Catholic cannot vote for Obama, they are well articulated throughout this blog, I hope you will read them, pray and reconsider. But I will say that those who believe they can craft a human solution to this spiritual problem have inadvertantly left God out of the equaition. God does not ask us to understand and He does not expect us to do it all alone. He does expect us to obey His his commands, "You shall not Kill." And then He asks us to work, to pray and to fast. Please do that, then vote.

BTW, I happen to think McCain chose a very good Pro-life running mate. My sneaking suspicion is that God would approve.

Peggy, you'll do what you wish, of course.

But you don't really think that amounts to a defensible analysis, do you?

Bush didn't have 8 years to "stop abortion," because he's President, not dictator. He had exactly two opportunities to "stop abortion," and took them: Putting two pro-life Catholics on the Supreme Court. He didn't save Schiavo, because the President has no power to do such things, and even Congress overstepped its legal authority attempting to find a way to exert power in that case.


Trust me, dear, the war in Iraq won't do anything like the damage to our revenues that you'll see with Obamanomics. Get ready for 10% unemployment, if half his legislative agenda is enacted; most small businesses are already laying off people in advance, now that his election is nearly certain.

And since you care about innocent lives, is now really the time to abruptly abandon allies who finally trust us and have a fairly stable civil society to the tender mercies of Al Qaeda in Iraq? Having an innocent farmer's head sawed off to make an example of him for voting isn't quite as nasty as an abortion, but it comes close. Capturing a family's 11-year-old son and serving him to them, baked, on a platter, was one of AQI's more creative methods of intimidation; so perhaps they're almost as bad as NARAL, d'ya'think?

Ah, but that's right, you were more concerned that it costs a lot. As I said, Obama's policies overall will cost far more, but yes, you're correct, fighting terrorists is expensive.


Oddly, Georgia, the Carolinas, Texas, and other states have had a nice little economic boom during much of that period. Ever consider the notion that local policies might have a lot to do with such localized recessions?


Well, you can get on your knees and pray that you won't. But if his words and his friends and his policy-positions are anything to be trusted, when Obama takes office, you'll be singing: "Meet the new boss: Same as the old boss." (Where "the old boss" equals Jimmy Carter, Lyndon Johnson, maybe a bit of Herbert Hoover, Warren Harding, Richard Nixon....)

As a former Republican I have long been fed up with Bush and the current candidate for President, John McCain. McCain is no way perfectly pro-life. He fought hard in the Senate to keep the moral issues like abortion from being brought up for a vote. We know this from remarks made by former Senator Rick Santorum.

I decided that I would not vote for McCain because I never liked him or trusted him. I don't think he has a clue as to what to do about saving our economy. He is like Bush in that he's being run by the Neocons who tricked us into the war in Iraq. I want to see them purged from the Republican Party for all the damage they have done. If McCain wins they'll still be running things for another four years. I have long wanted to see them defeated. I was so looking forward to it with relish.

But....in recent days I have come to realize that I must hold my nose, once again, and vote for this pathetic Republican candidate for President because he definitely is the lesser of two evils regarding abortion, which is the criteria I have always put first and foremost in my votes. Chuck Baldwin, good man that he is, can't win. He has no chance. If McCain loses we all lose, especially the unborn.

How sad, that in order to do our Christian duty, we have to vote for someone who never should have been nominated. But then sometimes flawed men can become great men by the grace of God.

Pray the Rosary and the Chaplet of Divine Mercy for our nation and this election. I fear we are on the edge of a precipice.

Yes! We are not blessed with a perfect candidate to support who has the ability to win. In cases like this, we are told to support the candidate that will be less likely to “advance the morally flawed position”. In the case of life issues, that is clearly John McCain and his 100% pro-life running mate, Sarah Palin. Their combined records make the Republican ticket infinitely better than the radically anti-life ticket of Obama and pro-abortion- Catholic heretic Joe Biden. Yes, Biden is a heretic and Obama has vowed to pass FOCA which will guarantee unrestricted abortion on demand throughout the entire nine months on our tax dollar. He will not only NOT reduce abortions but he will make sure that all pro-life progress we have made over the years is reversed. As at least one of our bishops, Bishop Vasa, plainly says, there is no proportionate reason to justify voting for Barack Obama.

Only God can condemn you, but I can and will pray for you.

I would like to know why you would vote for Obama? Sincerely, I truly can not understand it. What is it that you think makes him worthy of your support even though he stands against the most basic teachings of Christ’s Church, the Church to whom Jesus himself gave the authority to teach?

If there were some clear evil supported by McCain but opposed by Obama, I could probably understand it. But there isn’t. Yes, McCain supports the war, but the war has never been declared unjust by the Church. That is one of the prudential judgment issues of the election. Also, McCain did not actually declare the war even if he, like most of the international community, did support it, and the Church does teach that we need to make sure we don’t leave the Iraqi people in a mess and without support.

Obama would have us pull out before the insurgents are contained. We are having success there and the lives of those people can not be left to the mercy of terrorists. But even if the war is the reason Catholics would vote for Obama, it still doesn’t excuse the support for the most pro-abortion candidate ever. It is not a proportionate reason. By all estimates I can find, even from liberal anti-war sites, the number of victims of the war in Iraq is likely less than 1,000,000. That is for the entire five years of war. It is horrible, but more than that many innocent unborn babies are killed EVERY YEAR in our country alone.

McCain supports the death penalty: But again, this is not an intrinsic evil. Regardless, since the reinstatement of the death penalty in the US in 1976, 1,119 people have been executed. The ACLU has determined that it is possible that 1 in 7 on death row may be innocent. That would mean that nearly 120 innocent people may have been put to death in the past 30 years. That is awful, and I would vote to abolish the death penalty if given the chance, but it is NOT a proportionate reason to vote for Obama. 1.3 MILLION babies are aborted EACH YEAR. 19000 of them are 21 weeks and ‘viable’ as though that makes a difference.

Obama has twisted the Sermon on the Mount to say it advocates for homosexual relations. The Church teaches they are evil.

All evidence, some of which is just now coming to light thanks to the utter failure of our mainstream media that rather frightenly promotes Obama, shows Obama to be a Marxist. His own words and the fact that he has surrounded himself with Marxists his entire life (Davis, Wright, Ayers, Odinga, the teachings of Saul Alinsky) point to his true self. The Church teaches that Marxism/Socialism/Communism are EVIL. Pope Benedict/then Cardinal Ratzinger wrote in Truth and Tolerance,

Where the Marxist ideology of liberation had been consistently applied, a total lack of freedom had developed, whose horrors were now laid bare before the eyes of the entire world. Wherever politics tries to be redemptive, it is promising too much. Where it wishes to do the work of God, it becomes not divine, but demonic.

Speaking of demonic… Have you seen Obama’s solicitation to children on his website? It is actually reminiscent of Hitler Youth tactics. Indoctrinate the youth…Bribe/threaten your grandparents to vote for Obama…Are you kidding me? What's next, turn your parents in if they speak out against the new Socialist regime? The tactics his supporters take to silence anyone who has the audacity to question him? Joe the plumber? Obama told his supporters he wanted them to “get in their faces”…Does any of this seem remotely Christian to you?

Barack Obama truly and sincerely scares me. It is the blind devotion that otherwise decent people seem to have for him that is the most disturbing. Why are you voting for this man? No one will say anything specific about what he plans to do, and certainly nothing that is significant enough to trump 45,000,000 + dead babies and counting.

Please, I truly want to understand.

I can't believe how brainwashed Catholics, and most Americans have become! It is truly unbeleavable. We are in the midst of the greatest holocost in human history. 40 million innocent lives have been taken by abortion since the Roe v Wade decision in 1976. Our Lord sheds many tears for each one of these children of His, that have been sacrificed for "convenience". The choice this election is simple. We have one candidate, Mr. Obama, who says that an unwanted baby is "punishment" and should simply be discarded like one would cut out a wart if the mother so wishes. The other, Mr. McCain, has always been a strident pro life senator and has Never voted in favor of abortion. The next president will likely pick several lifetime Supreme Court Justices, and their impact on abortion decisions such as Roe v. Wade will be significant. Add to that the liberal democrats perhaps obtaining a supermajority in the house, and we could have THE most pro abortion Supreme Court in history. So why do many Catholics vote for the Obama abortionist? They look the other way. Just like Catholics in Nazi Germany supported the genocide of the Jews, just like Catholics in the American South supported slavery and the subjugation of a race. This is insanity! Wake up Catholics. I might expect this irresponsible behavior from college students being brainwashed by ultraliberal professors, but come on, many of you have been brought up in the church and know the Commandment, thou shalt not kill. Please consider this, and lets get a pro life President into the Whitehouse. God is watching us.

There are many Catholics who are just called such. As Deacon Osgood was leading to. But to take one step further, their consciences are not in Keeping with Gods Love. Love gives Life, Love does not take away life. And really if you thought hard and deep, Life is a gift From God. He did not have to create each one of us but He did out of Love. And if we do not respect, honor, and adore Life, we forfeit our own future based on today's stance. The times are shortening rather quicker then expected, The Judge stands at the door for this "election"

what is the basis to determine a nation which is on the Total Edge of Destruction? Way of Life. When Morals are compromised to the very core of Life, that nation, society will judge as non-funtional. America is in Great Turmoil, Chaos, and for those who live superficial lives heaping to themselves ideas other than Gods, will perish. God is with the Just.

Just means to do what is good and right by Gods standards and not, mans nor Satans. Your god is the Devil he who votes against Life. Because as the Good Book says: The Devil is a Murder from the Beginning and guess what? He hasn't changed

Read your history books, read the Old Testament and find out what happens to peoples who err from Gods ways. God gave the Hebrews many many chances, but each time only a Few remained faithful. Wide is the way to Destruction, Narrow the way to Life. Which means your eyes see life on the Earth and not in Heaven which is Eternal. The Earth is Temporal but for those who do not really know God it means absolutely Nothing.

Thus Jesus died for those poor souls who will never be saved.

Peace May God still have Mercy on your poor souls.

The other thing I get from Jesus is this: It does no good to argue with the Devil and his followers because they are cunning and crafty, and when it comes to arguing they will always win because, they are agressive where as Christians are more passive due to their total trust in God as Creator and Bounty, which means everything of life in life comes from God Himself. Nothing else creates nor breaths life but God. Best thing to do is pray and sacrifice through alms of the spirit such as Divine Mercy and lots of Rosaries. And sing the Ave Stella Maris like the old days where a war was won by Calling upon the Holy Virigin, She actually has bruised Satan's head that is why he is no longer before Heaven but on the Earth. Think of it this way: An Angel who has fallen, he fell because of Envy, Pride, Ego, selfishness, jealousy and he did not want to Serve,
Mud which is what the flesh of man is created from.

When a Higher being who stands in the True Presence of God falls from Grace, in this case because he did not want to serve
mud, God uses Satan to serve, Gods purposes and makes these angels lower than mud. The are lower then "Dust" Excrement.

The Proverb about the Silver smith which states: " in the "Fire" goes the silver clump to purify the silver till it is clean of all impurities so that it Shines the Image of God,
perfectly and clearly. This is the intended, not all souls desire to be pure. For those who are weak and were not fully able to purify on Earth end up in Purgatory where there are no
devils but only the purifying fires to further remove the impurities in the soul. Hell is fire, Purgatory is the same as hell for souls destined to Heaven. The with a few changes. First while on Earth the Devil roams here and there seeking to devour, but for Christians the Devil points out our weaknesses, which is very very helpful. If we did not have any weaknesses, he would not be needed. Rather ingenious of God to use all things for Good as Romans 8 says. He uses all things for our good if we let Him. And our present sufferings are tiddly winks compared to life Eternal where there will be no end of days. No calendar. Just NOW always NOW how beautiful it will be. Kind of hard to imagine carnally speaking, but with your soul, God shows His true Beauty. Only in your soul. Your spiritual eyes are within it must be brought forward in order to receive the sight. God is Light, He brings Light to your soul to show the way. The closer you walk with God, the More Light He shines. The more Lighe means the cleaner your soul is becoming and all bad habits and vices become like paper weight as you climb up towards Mt. Zion, Gods Throne, the Kingdom of No End.

Allow God to work through you. The battle is taking place with souls. Your soul was created to be an Altar for God. In the Old Testament, the Ark housed God. Which tells tale of how God wishes to reside in man, in his soul which is your heart. In the New Testament reading St. Paul, he states "we are the Temples of the Holy Spirit. It was through the Holy Spirit who in the beginning gave Life to man. He animated man. The Holy Spirit is Sanctification and Love. Father and Son or Mastermind and Word breathed into man, the Breath of God is the Holy Spirit. He is the Grace which God gave to Adam and Eve but through there selfish desire they lost this Grace, the Sanctifier of Life. And thus He was only given to an elected few which we read about in the Old Testament, the prophets, such as Moses, Elijah, etc.,.

continued...

After Jesus was crucified, raised and ascended, the Sanctifier returned to Embrace all souls who Accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, the Heart which says Love is here to embrace me and take me to my Home in Heaven. Which is what God designed in the First Place. The Earth was just a place to procreate more of mankind and to perfect man so he can return to the Home waiting at the end of a good and perfect life. Man was given a great gift to experience flesh. God does not have flesh, Angels do not possess flesh. Jesus had to take on Flesh to save man.
So now the Word of Life is both Flesh and God or Spirit.

That is Love my friends. But in this messed up world where demons turn truth into lies, it doesn't seem that way, nor look that way, nor feel that way because we have been de-spiritualized, as the result of original sin; as if we were angels that had our wings clipped and fell to the lower regions.

In the end, anyone who supported abortion will answer for it in front of God's judgment seat. I don't want to get blood on my hands from such a horrible crime.

However I'm a pharmacist and my niece is a medical student. Obama, if elected, will enact FOCA - Freedom of Choice Act, which ironically will trample my and my niece's freedom to choose not to have anything to do with abortion. As a pharmacist, I would be forced to dispense abortive drugs and birth control pills. Obgyn doctors would be forced to carry out abortions. Hospitals would be forced to provide abortions and pharmacies would be forced to carry abortafacient drugs. My taxes would be used to pay for abortions in the USA and even abroad. Parents with teenage daughters would end up in a situation where parental consent/notification of abortion would be abolished, and liberal schoolteachers or even the men who impregnated their daughters would make the "choice" to manipulate and push the girls to have abortions.

Where's my choice in this?? Where's the pro-life pharmacist's, doctor's, tax payer's or parent's choice in this DICTATORSHIP OF DEATH that Obama plans to FORCE ON EVERYBODY?!!

Finally, I don't buy for a second the argument that our economy will flourish in a dictatorship of death. Regardless of how smart our leaders are, we need God's blessing IN THE FIRST PLACE to create wealth, peace, success, and I just don't believe that God will bless our country if our hands will be dripping with the blood of innocents.

Nothing invites God's wrath like the shedding of innocent blood and sexual immorality. With Obama, we will get both of these and anyone voting for Obama is essentially voting for the destruction of our country.

If you don't believe me, go visit the ruins of Nineveh. Try to find the remnants of ancient cultures that worshipped Moloch and practiced child sacrifice. Visit the ruins of the Aztec Empire - they killed children, too. God wiped them off the face of the Earth.

There's no reason to believe that God will have mercy on the USA if we continue on the path of legitimizing murder and electing leaders like Obama. We are all together in this boat and we will go down together - innocents will suffer together with the guilty, when the punishment comes.

But we are not yet there, and we must use our weapons now: Attend the Holy Mass, pray, fast, and do not vote for Obama.

I agree with some of the points in your comments. The upshot seems to be that McCain is not perfect. Very true. But think of the consequences of your vote.

There won't be a FOCA with McCain.

There won't be Federal funding of abortions under McCain.

There won't be the appointment of obviously Pro-Abortion Supreme Court Justices under McCain.

But there will be all these things with Obama.

You may not agree with McCain's political strategies and some pro-life inconsistencies, but that does not justify voting for an avowed pro-abortion candidate.

"[t]here may be times when a Catholic who rejects a candidate's unacceptable position may decide to vote for that candidate for other grave reasons"

If you dare, listen to Bishop Martino's reponse via video. Go to http://dioceseofscranton.org/ and scroll down to videos and click on "Bishop Martino's Message on Respect Life Sunday"

Taken from the Diocese of Scranton website:

Catholics dedicated to the common good will at some point ask themselves what their attitude should be toward Roe v. Wade, the 1973 Supreme Court decision that mandated the legalization of abortion for the whole nine months of pregnancy in all 50 states. As of 2008 the Court’s establishment of a constitutional right to abortion has resulted in 48.5 million abortions. The key question is whether the Catholic understanding of the common good gives Catholics permission to be silent on this legally authorized murder of the unborn? Cardinal Francis George of Chicago recently gave a clear answer to this question: “Laws that place unborn children outside the protection of law destroy both the children and the common good, which is the controlling principle of Catholic social teaching. One cannot favor the legal status quo on abortion and also be working for the common good.” Back in 1988 Pope John Paul II addressed the same question in his book-length exhortation on the vocation and mission of the laity. “Above all, the common outcry, which is justly made on behalf of human rights – for example, the right to health, to home, to work, to family, to culture – is false and illusory if the right to life, the most basic and fundamental right and the condition for all other rights, is not defended with maximum determination."

Bitterness toward Bush and disgust for the Republican party are not compelling reasons to vote for Obama. I've noticed, sadly, that some of the more eloquent and knowledgeable posts here come from those who are defending a vote for him.

Could it be you're not seeing the forest for the trees?

Trees: 8 years of bitterness and partisanship from both sides of the isle during the Bush administration, a heartbreaking war, Karl Rove, economic troubles, etc. etc. etc. Very frustrating and distracting, making it easy to buy into the promises of "change".

Forest: a positively thriving pornography industry, little progress in a pro-life direction, rapidly spreading acceptance of same-sex marriage, gay "pride" parades in which the likes of Nancy Pelosi et al march smilingly alongside members of NAMBLA and people who hurt themselves and others for pleasure, etc. etc. etc. A nation in moral decline at lightning speed.

Todd says the abortion issue is addictive to both sides. I say politics is more so, by a long shot. It's totally seductive - you can see it right here on this blog - to use knowledge of stats from past elections to spar with friends and on-line, to memorize which states are what color and your party's talking points, to spew forth your wisdom in posts such as this one. We all do it for our own reasons, for genuine concern for the issues, for fun and entertainment, or for both.

The din during this election has become deafening and this is a tragedy. When one is so caught up in the talking points, in reading the paper and watching the talking heads, in blogging, in obsessing over the flawed ideas put forth by one or the other party - when one ceases to realize that BOTH parties are immensely tainted by human failing in innumerable ways, then, Catholic or not, that person has lost their objectivity.

It's kind of scary to consider not voting or voting third party - one feels like one's not contributing to the process, and I am angry to be put in that position. I will have a hard time pulling a lever at all this year, but I can tell you one thing - it won't be for Barack Obama.

I think I am in the "et al." My objection to the republicans and my observation that abortion is not a major vote getting issue this year does NOT mean I will vote for Obama. Todd said the same thing (tho NHCatholic did say he would vote for him).

Just because we disgree with the current pro life strategy and the way Republicans use it does not mean we are pro abortion or voting for Obama! Abortion should be illegal, I agree. But it is not a big issue this year because of the economy. Our fellow pro lifers ignore that and then attack us when we read them the poll numbers! I think thats why we are reacting. Shouldnt people who AGREE on pro life be able to talk about different strategies and not be called secret Obama voters?

Pamela and all, thanks for your replies to my questions.

I understand that I can't vote for Obama due to the life issues, but I am a Democrat otherwise.

I see lots of reasons on this thread being thrown around about why McCain is the better candidate, outside of the life issues. In other words, many people on here agree with McC/P on many other issues other than life issues, which makes their decision an easy one indeed.

My question for those folks, who feel in tune with McC/P on most issues, not just the life issues, is this: If the situation was reversed, just reverse the stance on life issues between the two candidates but keep all other stances on everything else the same, how would you be feeling right now?

How would you feel then about voting for Obama? Would it be easy for you? Would you feel excited about it?

That's the core of the problem. In the early 60's, Cardinal Cushing of Boston had a chance to make sure that contraception (and coming after it, abortion) would never be enshrined into law in Massachusetts by putting the weight of the then-powerful Church behind the efforts to oppose the legalization of contraception in the Massachusetts legislature. Well, he chose ethnic (ie, Irish) and party loyalty over the Catholic truth when he gave the green light for JFK and other Catholics like him to "not impose their morality on a pluralistic society" and thus allow for contraception to be legalized in Massachusetts. Cushing cared more for the advancement of the Irish and Democrats than he did for the faith. This in turn paved the way for the "personally opposed but..." dodge we hear from Catholic pols of both parties but still predominantly Democrat who are pro-abortion in their policy stances and votes.

God help us if Catholics help put pro-abortion, pro-infanticide Obama into the White House. The long march to national perdition will be led by quisling Catholics like these.

Real quick, et al included the OTHER Joe (Joe H.) even though he has not commented on this thread, because he has stated that he's voting for Obama, and NHCatholic, and anyone else who is a practicing Catholic who is voting for Obama. You did not stand out to me as someone who is voting for Obama, and you have interesting things to say. Maybe I stand corrected on Todd. Todd, are you out there?

I'm trying to deconstruct why Catholics are voting for Obama and I think my point is a good one.

Our Lord told us that as we sow, so shall we reap. We can't plant onion seeds and expect to gather a crop of corn.

If we allow pornography in our homes via TV and internet, we can't expect young men to treat our daughters with dignity and respect.

If we accept torturing even our vilest enemies, we must not expect to be seen as agents of good.

If we contracept, we should not expect children to be seen as God's blessing.

If we support no-fault divorce, we can't point to homosexual marriage as a twisted satire of holy matrimony.

If we are "personally opposed to abortion, but support a woman's right to choose" we can't expect the ocean of innocent blood not to be on our hands.

If we green light scientific research on human embryos, we must expect our bodies will be seen as mere objects -- machines to harvest speare parts.

If we give a nod to "mercy killing" we ought not be surprised that our insurance company or own children will one day order our death by lethal injection.

Recognition and respect for the sacredness and dignity of every human life is so foundational, everything else is based on it. No other issue else - nothing - has a proportionate claim on the objective reality of our moral life.

Bruce,

Eloquently and perfectly stated! Unlike the empty "hope, change, hope, change" mantra from the Obama-zombies, your words have depth and meaning. In fact, their plain-spoken truth echo the words and actions of Sarah Palin...and that's a compliment despite the hatchet job she faces in the Obama media daily.

Hi, Ann,

As I said in my (lengthy) earlier post, I find Obama scary, not just in his position on abortion. I find him wrong on pretty much everything. I think his policies/tactics/ideology will severely damage our country both economically and morally, diminish our true Constitutionally guaranteed freedoms, harm our security, etc... So no, I would not be excited about voting for him. In that case, I might very well use my legitimate option to sit at home. However, if I felt he was truly dedicated to life, I would not FEAR him quite to the point I do. He'd be sort of like Mike Huckabee (though admittedly much worse). ;) I think Huckabee's temptation to grow government in order to take care of all the ills is worrisome, (since it does not work) but I feel his heart is in the right place.

That is probably the biggest problem with Obama and the Democratic Party, for that matter. He preaches hope, yet he has no value for life. How can one trust that he has his heart in the right place to care for any needs when he/they show such disdain for our right to life?

On the other hand, I'm much more supportive of Sarah Palin than McCain,so I'll use Sarah for the example. If she were pro-abortion, I'd be disappointed, to say the least, but I would still NEVER vote for her, assuming the option was pro-life.

May I ask why you are a Democrat? What is it about the party that appeals to you? Do you not feel that the things that once made the Democratic Party appealing have been pushed aside by the frankly immoral positions that have become the platform or the organizations that the party has become beholden to?

Sincerely,

Pamela

Ann,

Thanks for asking your thoughtful question. I vote for McCain/Palin for three primary reasons.
1) The life issues -- lots of cyber-ink spilled by myself and others on that one so not much more can be said.
2) National defense in the War against Global Jihad -- despite a general mood of war weariness (natural in any prolonged conflict), this is one battle in an existential conflict that we (the Christian world, especially in the West) have been fighting with the so-called "religion of peace" for over 1400 years. McCain has the steel in his spine to prosecute this war correctly and learn from the mistakes Bush has made in prosecuting it. Obama has shown a Lennon-esque naivete and willingness to appease the likes of Mahmoud Ahmadenijad and Kim Jong-Il as well as practice bellus interruptus in Iraq.
3) Energy independence -- This is tied in with #2 above since ultimately the more we Americans control and develop a myriad of home-grown sources of energy (oil, natural gas, biofuels, etc), the less we have to even worry about the Islamic world and the Hugo Chavez's or Vladimir Putins of this world who have control of the energy we depend on.

That would be my elevator speech (3 bullets or less) for McCain/Palin. Are they perfect? No, but I'm not going to let the perfect (ie, a Constitution Party candidate) be the enemy of the good.

Why are Catholics voting for Obama?

Ask them what they think of our current President.

Most of them, like most of the country, will have a very negative view of the current holder of hte office. It is so bad, that the worst thing that Obama says about McCain is that he is a continuation of Bush. Nothing more and nothing less.

Can you think of a more complete repudiation of a man and his policies?

Now, Bush was elected with the help of pro-life voters who were told that while they might be inclined towards some of Gore's or Kerry's position, they owed it to their faith to help elect Bush.

Eight (or four) years later they see what their faithfulness has brought upon them.

Perhaps they think that they have had enough of electing incompents to high office, with the excuse of their being pro-life, that there are things that they have the right to expect from a government, and that they should look for the candidate who looks like he can deliver.

It would not surprise me if they were bitter with pro-life leaders, for sticking them with a President they neither like nor respect, and who they cannot wait until he finally leaves office.

Hi Pamela,

Thanks for your response.

Yes, when I examine the major issues, other than abortion of course, I feel more aligned with Democrats. Other than abortion, my major issues this election cycle are healthcare, pollution and the environment, and the war, all of which I believe the Democrats will do a better job on going forward. I also care about strengthening Social Security and the ability of students to go to college. I believe that the past eight years have been a disaster under Bush and we need a change of leadership.

Sounds like you align with McCain on most issues vs. Obama.

On my question, how would you feel about voting for Obama if he and McCain's stance on life issues were switched, but nothing else was? Could you do it?

Sorry I thought you were talking to me!

I am an independent but I agree with the Democrats on most things. I will not vote for Obama because abortion is a crime against women and children, and I cannot do anything to help it spread, even though I like Obama on other things. But I also definitly won't vote for McCain, so I haven't decided what to do yet.

I hear your points : )

But back to my question...

If McCain and Obama were exactly the same as they are now on everything but the life issues, and you switched the life issues around, could you vote for Obama? How would you feel about that?

I suggest that, regardless of the election outcome, if the Freedom of Choice Act is passed and signed into law, it will be necessary to begin a massive civil disobedience effort in order for some of us to live with our consciences.

If McCain were the pro-abortion candidate and Obama the pro-life candidate, I would vote 3rd party (Constitution Party). Obama's socialism, weak national defense, and anti-energy independence stances would lead me to vote against him anyway even if he is pro-life. McCain's pro-abortion stance would cause me to vote against him in conscience for the exact same reasons I vote against Obama today.

Adriana,

Where do you think the anti-Bush sentiment comes from? How about 8 years of relentless Bush-bashing by the media and Democrat Party whose mouthpiece the media is. Yes, Bush has made his fair share of mistakes, but to call him an idiot or incompetent is simply not true. He shares some blame for mistakes made about the Iraq War, but then again so does the Clinton administration and the world intelligence community all of whom believed as we did in 2002 that Saddam Hussein was on the cusp of reconstituting his WMD program. He shares some blame for the response to Hurricane Katrina, but then again so do the Democrat Mayor of New Orleans and the Democrat Governor of Louisiana both of whom showed gross negligence in mobilizing the population of the city to get out -- remember the parking lot full of empty school busses in New Orleans? But, the media only portrays these mistakes as solely Bush's.

As for Bush being blamed for having 8 years to end abortion with no success, he has done as much as he could do given the fact that the pro-life side doesn't yet have a majority on the Court. He signed the Partial Birth Abortion Ban Act into law and he favored the Born Alive Infant Protection Act. He also banned federal funding of embryonic stem cell research. His pro-life policies and stances have led to a gradual weakening of the culture of death, especially in some states such as South Dakota. Young people are increasingly pro-life, and they represent the future. All of these gradual gains are threatened by Obama and his ilk.

While I share and understand some of your frustration with Bush and his admitted imperfections, if you help elect Obama, I don't want to hear you and the other Obama supporters complain a year from now how abominably pro-abortion he turned out to be. Deal Hudson, myself, and others like me have been saying for months that Obama will be one of the worst Presidents in our history viewed from the life perspective, not to mention the liberty, free enterprise, the war, etc. He will be worse than a Carter 2.0 administration.

To clarify one of my points above, I realize the Clinton administration was not in office in 2002. I was simply saying that the Clinton administration and Senate Democrats believed along with the world intelligence community back in the late 90s during the run-up to Operation Desert Fox that Saddam was reconstituting his WMD program. Bush simply inherited this intelligence and, unlike Clinton, acted on it.

Deal,
Good points. I agree.
Many will go to any length to justify voting for Obama.
As many here have pointed out, allowing the promotion of abortion
legislation will only add to the moral decay of our country.
Freedom of Choice??? The Catholic Church ain't Burger King and Murder isn't on the menu.

1 Samuel 1:18
"And you shall cry out in that day from the face of the king, whom you have chosen to yourselves: and the Lord will not hear you in that day, because you desired unto yourselves a king."

Lord have mercy.

Sam:

Do you think by explaining to me how Bush was ill served by the media, and how he does not deserve comdemnation will change the way most American feel about him?

Face it, when fellow Republicans run away from any contact or reference, let alone endorsement, form their President, that shows how unloved and disrespected he is.

Probably future historians will reassess his Presidency. But by then the election will have come and gone.

Now, a lot of Catholics feel *very* disappointed in the man the pro-life movement told them it was the best choice, and are reluctant to take that advice again, so they will come up with a thousand and one excuses to vote the other way.

The main reason is that the last time they followed that advice, they ended up with a lemon.

Todd: In regard to your answer to my post, I challenge your analysis on the following points:

Incompetence: 'Katrina' was handled badly first & foremost by the mayor of New Orleans & Governor of Louisiana, both Democrats & both having the PRIMARY responsibility. Corruption in New Orleans led to this disaster being worse than it should have been.

As to 'managing the peace in Iraq', this was handled badly at first, but after Pres. Bush saw the need for a surge (thanks, in part to John McCain), things have gotten much better. As to 'being asleep on pre-9/11 intelligence, Bush had only been in office for less than 9 months. Clinton certainly knew more than he cares to disclose, but did nothing for 8 years...

Corruption: You mention the Justice Dept. What are you talking about? No examples given here.

Immorality: 'Republicans caught in sex acts...' Did you forget that Rep. Barney Frank had been exposed as running a male prostitution ring out of his townhome a few years ago? Of course, he denies this, just as he denies being partly responsible for the sub-prime mortgage crisis. And what about the Democratic congressman from south Florida who took the place of Rep. Mark Foley (Republican)when he was caught sending questionable e-mails to some of his young pages. This paragon of virtue got on t.v. to tell everyone how 'upright' he was during his campaign against Foley, while at the same time having an affair with one of his employees, whom he later fired.

I disagree that the issue of abortion is a moot one. Many Catholics are very concerned about the life & family (social) issues, especially as they relate to the kinds of justices each candidate will nominate to the courts. This may be why McCain is picking up steam with Catholics, who are finally seeing Obama for what he really is -- an extremist on abortion, among other things. Check out the websites for the National Right to Life, as well as Priests for Life, American Life League, etc. and you'll see how involved in these issues Catholics are.

"Shouldnt people who AGREE on pro life be able to talk about different strategies and not be called secret Obama voters?"

Silly.

It's part of the addiction: crazy talk and stinkin' thinkin'. If you don't accept that drugs and alcohol are good, you can love the addict and it doesn't mean a thing. You have to love the addiction, just like the addict.

For many fringe liberals and conservatives -- and I've known both -- it's an emotional addiction. Someone above said it's more about politics than abortion for more people. I would agree. But for many of those in the anti-abortion St Blog's commentariat, it's pretty grim. If you can't go lockstep with the talking points, you're a heretic.

It's easy.

Meg was polite enough to ask, so I'll tell: I was a Democrat for a few months in 2000 so I could participate in the Iowa caucuses. Otherwise I've been a proud independent. If I could have caucused as an independent, I would have done so. I voted the pro-life ticket often in New York when it was offered in the 80's. I'm not a fan of the two-party system.

I do enjoy politics. My wife worries that someday I'll come home and say, "Honey, guess what? I'm running for city council!"

I believe I've said on this site at least one other time I've only voted a major party candidate for president once. (Never Ross Perot, though.)

I will confess I'm proud I will be volunteering to be a county election worker. Next Tuesday I'm taking a vacation day and I'm looking forward to working long and hard where needed from 6AM till when the polls close.

Meanwhile I'm going to continue being a pro-life independent who is critical of the Republican Party. And the other one, too. But just because I'm not voting for McCain doesn't mean I'm voting pro-choice in the upcoming election.

My dear wife remains happy. I'm way too much of a maverick to get tabbed to run for political office. With that, I think I'm going to withdraw from political comment here for another week. I stopped commenting politically on my blog a few weeks ago, and that's a healthier practice, at least for me.

Deal, You are exactly right on the perceived loopholes. The problem is that the average Catholic is not adequately catechized to understand what constitutes a "morally grave reason." His conscience has not been properly formed to adequately assess the situation. This comes from years of poor catechism and weak/distracted leadership.

When you have so many uneducated in their faith, publish a position that requires a level of understanding above that of the common Catholic, and add the nefarious arguments of Obama apologists, it is not hard to understand what is happening.

Here is our consolation, though - and indeed it is worth more than all of the election victories this country has to offer. The battle is the Lord's (2 Chron 20:15). Whatever happens, Christ is still King. No matter how bad it may seem, no matter what we have to suffer, no matter what the odds, we know who wins. It is simply a matter of time.

Pray for our nation, that she may turn from her sin. Pray for those Catholics who are not remaining faithful, that they may return to the truth. Pray for our bishops, that they have the strength to courageously teach that truth with clarity and conviction.

Not only is our pastor not speaking out in defense of life prior to the election, but now a directive has come from the USCCB to all dioceses that we are not to cooperate with the National Right to Life. Does anyone know why?

Tomorrow a number of us will be distributing pro-life literature in our church parking lot, but now we'll be doing this in defiance of our bishop and pastor. We also face possible attacks from fellow parishioners.

What is happening?!

I am sickened by all the anti-abortion multiple wife-dumpers who got annulments from childbirth-disfigured wives, then command all other American women to risk similar betrayals by voting for such wife-abusers in the name of the child-molesting, Nazi-electing Vatican. My best friend was gruesomely killed by her last pregnancy (and incesting husband). She already suffered an in-remission daughter-caused, face-eating skin cancer, but her new husband bullied her into breeding for his parents. The new fetus, being also female, caused her cancer to return and her husband soon absconded with the new daughter. He got to keep her in spite of admitted incest because the mother soon had no nose, eye, ear, lips, palates and finally no life. He should be in jail for killing her with a cancer-causing fetus. My own Munchausen by Proxy mother suffered childbirth-caused incontinence and was encouraged by a philandering priest to disfigure me as her abstinence-only excuse since Natural Family Planning failed her. The priest also encouraged Dad to drink and go to hookers. I wish I had been aborted and encourage all Catholics to vote for the right to life, health, looks and faithful husbands by voting for pro-choice candidates. The Vatican's ban on effective contraception and maternal life-saving emergency abortions is simply PRO-PEDOPHILE MATRICIDE HERESY. By the way, why hasn't the "all-knowing" Vatican banned abortifacient COFFEE??